New system aimed primarily at matching newer sellers with buyers
So now it seems I have to wait two hours before I can bid for a job. This is extremely unfair. Not only do experienced creatives/designers have to compete with an unfair playing field, ie people offered to do a job for £10 when it is clearly worth £100, we are now not allowed to bid for jobs as soon as they appear on PPH. What kind of system is this?!
Awful. Unfair. Unprofessional. Discriminatory.
Regards
C. Howe
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wow you guys have been busy! I have crappy Internet for a couple of days and come back to an inbox full of notifications :) Having read through them all to catch up the main one I want to comment on is, I think, from Paul, I can't find it now. Regarding proposal credits, I agree they should be done away with completely. I have 174 sitting there doing nothing yet another Cert 5 freelancer I know has used up her 15 and doesn't see why she should have to buy more when others, myself included, are getting thrown at them and not using them. Not a greatly interesting post granted, I just wanted to share my view on things :) Michael, if you're around can you transfer some of mine to her account please :D
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What I would also like to find out is if the CEO of the Company knows about how bad the service is and how upset all freelancers here are (whether it's newbies or older freelancers...if he does and chooses to ignore it, then this isn't an organisation I want to work for. This is really just waste of time as I am unable to respond to any jobs that I have skills for!
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What I would also like to find out is if the CEO of the Company knows about how bad the service is and how upset all freelancers here are (whether it's newbies or older freelancers...if he does and chooses to ignore it, then this isn't an organisation I want to work for. This is really just waste of time as I am unable to respond to any jobs that I have skills for!
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I think we should be realistic about our ability to influence the PPH ship. We are a few 'loud' freelancers amidst a sea of silent freelancers. We won't be chatting with the CEO and changing the world. PPH will steer the ship another way when they decide that their ship is heading for a reef.
Xenios did do a few Google hangouts a few years back and I participated in one. I expected to be in a group of critical people, but in fact everyone was doing the equivalent of high-fives and I was the only only one being critical.
I realised then that we are probably not representative of the people that Xenios encounters, and most likely it's easy to dismiss us as a load of whingers dead set on rolling the clock back rather than moving forward.
This forum is as much about airing frustration and bemusement at PPH antics than anything else.
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I am getting quite frustrated with my emails, being selected to bid first on jobs that are no where near my skill set, I seem to be getting mainly fashion/ pattern cutter jobs, I am a graphic designer PPH, why is this happening? The system was fine a month ago I was receiving the right jobs, what happened?
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I've moved from a Cert 4 to a Cert 3 as I have not been able to get any work on PPH in over two months with this new system. Fortunately my partnership with other freelancers out side of PPH is yielding jobs. I really liked PPH but it's gone down hill. eLance is the best for me as I win $2,000 jobs weekly. Guru.com is next as I get a job each month. Freelancer.com and ODesk are total crap. And now ... PPH is as bad as Freelancer or ODesk. I never won any work on them, and PPH is now the same.
The partnership I'm in is too new to tell if it will beat eLance. If I stop using PPH, I can spend more time on my own promotional efforts. I've stated advertising to get work.
I think PPH is driving away freelancers and STOP giving away free bids. Really, that just causes MORE bids per job and I am not sure that's the way to do. Really, it seems as if they are trying anything. SuperTasker, discount hourlies, free bids.
I don't know, with eLance moving into the Aus market (taking on Freelancer.com), and Freelancer.com buying Warrior Forum, not to mention eLance buying ODesk it seems that there may not be room for smaller players.
In the end, if freelancers can't win bids, they are going to leave. And the Cert thing does not seem to add any value, at least not for me.
This week I halted bidding on PPH because I have enough other work and unless I can find a way to win bids, my time is better invested with my own group of consultants. Or even looking at the Maven thing.
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This whole platform has turned out to be a piece of cr'p, i am also sick on getting alerts for jobs not in my area and no way to change - then on top asking if id promote PPH and recommend / add a widget to my website bahahahahaha someone must be making some money here , shame it not the freelancers
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One can only hope that the fact that DeskDonkie alias Supertasker has taken off like a lead balloon might finally convince them that people don't WANT pph to control the selection process - they can do it better themselves. People aren't puppets, they don't need anyone pulling their strings. They want a platform where clients and freelancers can meet and build relationships and get work done with as little intrusion and interference as possible from the platform host. Drop the dead donkey, but I suppose someone has to pay for the money that was invested in it.
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@James - What you don't seem to taking into account is that there are different people bringing forward the same complaints. How do you propose all new complaints are ceased? By simply wiping out the history of complaints and creating a new thread whenever the old one has too many complaints by too many people?
What you don't seem to be aware of is that there are many that have simply left as you have suggested or as in my case simply ceased stopped expecting to get work here and wait to see if PPH pulls their finger out at some point. Based on the site viewing figures a huge number of people have ceased to use the site, that will include buyers as well as sellers.
I still can't help but read your response as "put up and shut up", which is much in line with PPH's approach. You manage to complain about complainers in the middle of humungous posts containing a long list of complaints from yourself. Irony?
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@pie
Yes, why not let the CLIENT decide who is bid worthy or not. But I think the PPH is trying to get happy clients by pre-selecting the right freelancers. However, some clients post and don't check back for days. So the "first in" approach makes no sense. And given that some clients WANT lots of bids, they see no advantage in selecting from the first bid.
In one way, eLance is the ONLY company that solved that problem (too many bids). Each freelancer MUST choose a category to bid in. Extra categories cost $5 per month. And you get no extra free bids for that.
I pay $20 per month on eLance but for bids, that gives me 60 bids in ONE category. I could pay to be in a second, but I find all my jobs in ONE category.
I also find that on eLance, the budgets are MUCH higher. The is, the "willing to spend" for websites is double. Other tech stuff is also higher.
I really like PPH (in concept) but just HATE all these changes. Wonder if they will be here in a year?
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@Dee
What you don't seem to taking into account is that there are different people bringing forward the same complaints
Of course I see that.How many more users complaining do you think will mean more attention from PPH?
There are 450,000 users on PPH. How many are here complaining?Lets say more and more users come forward, and I'll be incredibly generous (and for simplicity) and say 450 users end up complaining in this thread, that's only 0.1% of users complaining. A mere tenth of a percent.
Why would PPH stand up and make serious changes from 1% of their customers, let alone a tenth of a percent? And it's a lot less than 0.1% as well!If an additional 2,000 users complained in this thread, we'd still only be around 0.5% total users, a mere half a percent.
Would it make any difference?Maybe, who knows. The point is, if PPH are interested in what we say, then it would have already been actioned in some way - reverted features, or at least acknowledgement of the features being poor and something is to be done.
But nothing... They're probably sat drinking £100 a bottle red wine, laughing at us squabbling...
It was in no way "shut up Dee and sit quietly". That would have been rude, and I'm an advocate of being heard as it is often the only thing which brings about changes in this world - but only when it's viable or worthwhile!
And it's pointless repeating non-constructive discussions which are not about the actual issues, and then repeating discussions about speculative things and what each other has said, and then discussions about the discussions of everything and the speculative things...i.e. the noise.
It all just takes away focus and some validity from the actual complaints, and collectively sounds more like a bunch of people having a moan, than a structured complaint about something real.
This post I am writing is a prime example of noise, and is an example of why I said what I did about Michael's new thread.Based on the site viewing figures a huge number of people have ceased to use the site, that will include buyers as well as sellers.
"A huge number" - Do you have figures, or a percentage of total users?
Have you considered the many influencing factors which can change a busy website's viewing figures?
What was the change in viewers September to October 2013? Other factors such as PPH advertising, changes in specific countries, demographic considerations, etc etc.The number of users who have left the site due to the issues already raised will likely be a drop in the ocean, compared to 450,000 users staying AND the fact new members will be signing up each day who do not have these gripes, as the system is "as is" to them and no changes for the worse.
We're all a drop in the ocean, and it's likely business as usual for PPH with a few users bothered/complaining/etc (< 0.1% remember).
So we have no choice but to hope they are already listening, and agreeing with at least some of the comments so far.I still can't help but read your response as "put up and shut up", which is much in line with PPH's approach.
If you already feel this is PPH's approach, why do you feel a handful of other users repeating the same issues could make a difference?You manage to complain about complainers in the middle of humungous posts containing a long list of complaints from yourself. Irony?
Maybe even contradictory, however I am male :PNo, I did not complain about the complainers. I suggested to them that further complaints and chatter/noise/extended discussions are pointless, not constructive, clutter the real constructive complain posts, and are possibly falling on deaf ears.
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There are 450,000 users on PPH. How many are here complaining?
There may be 450k registered users but I'm sure nowhere near that many active. Have you seen all the unanswered posts saying 'How do I delete my account?' PPH don't make it obvious how to escape, once you've got signed up.
"A huge number" - Do you have figures, or a percentage of total users?
PPH's global rank went down by 140 positions (today's stats) over the last 3 months and in fact most of that decline happened since mid September. That's a massive drop and that's exactly the kind of data that PPH do take notice of, historically. Not quality, not satisfaction, but driving footfall and visibility - that's their business model, hence the carrot to 'invite your friends', hence creating an unasked-for account for everybody that endorses a PPHer, hence spamming people's facebook pages by default, hence the endless spam emails and all the rest of it. That's why I was momentarily hopeful Michael might have been briefed to halt the decline and make a few token gestures to get people back on board.
But he seems to have vanished.
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But he seems to have vanished.
Yes, all other debates aside, this does seem to be the case. Even when he was here briefly, his posts were only generic info and no agreeing or promises. Just the usual generic fluff so far.
The first post I replied aimed towards Michael was giving him/PPH a chance. But I see I had false hope of his providing some kind of resolve, or even explanation on a business level for the changes etc.
We're just left with the fact all our accounts were blocked, even users PPH's systems deemed as already trust-able and worthy of high start ratings.
I've stopped bidding anyway, for reasons given in this thread, and other reasons.
In an attempt to dig out of the "you have no PPH history" syndrome. I tried on some low paid jobs which were hundreds of ££ too short given the requirement and my skills/experience. But even buyers with no PPH history rejected my proposals due to having no PPH history.
This is the same on other sites, of course, but at least other sites seem better setup than this one...
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Not sure why they bother with the word 'curated' though.
It's been one of PPH's favourite words for a long while. The advantage of using a meaningless word is, nobody can accuse you of being misleading because nobody knows exactly what you're claiming.
Though it sounds painful to me. I wouldn't like to be curated by PPH.
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On a lighter note, just been checking out the 'About Us' section. Don't know about any other blokes on here, but wouldn't mind working with Vicky or Voula though :)
Before I forget, with regards to the user base, it might seem obvious, but, as someone pointed out slightly earlier on, out of all the 'registered' users, we don't know how many of those are actually active on the site. By that I mean how many of those are actually actively bidding on/posting jobs, and providing profit for PPH. It's all well and good saying there are 450000 users on the site, but how many of those are actually PROPERLY using it.
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I've found the 450,000. It was in a press release from July 2013.
"Analytics Q&A: Kleanthis Georgaris at People Per Hour. PeoplePerHour now has more than 450, 000 registered users. Read More Saturday, July 27th, 2013" blog.peopleperhour.com/group/pressnews
Things have changed a lot since then. Now there are only 35,000 or so.
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@Moira -
**Calm down, please, Malcolm. **LOL, at least there are some good things at pph :)
Moira, the 35000 figure is JUST for the freelancers. So, whatever the TOTAL user figure is, the rest are, of course, the buyers. Not forgetting, of course, the unknown portion of freelancers that also happen to be buyers and vice versa. But what's important is the JOB ACTIVITY on the site, nothing more. The number of people 'accessing' the site, doesn't tell you anything.
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@Pie, thank you for responding to James' "noise", I seriously couldn't be bothered. Someone who spends that so many words advising others to shut up really... bored already with his hyperbole.
*Moira K
*Malcolm, that's how I got the 35,000-odd figure. I wondered where James found the 450,000 figure which he used as the basis for his calcs.
Based on everything else he's said, it appears to have been fished out of his preverbial...
I'd imagine much of the dead wood/inactive accounts were trimmed when everyone suddenly had to re-apply. It's pretty common to register to a site than never use it again, so all those curiosity registrations plus once active, but no longer active members will have fallen by the wayside I'd assume.
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